Final Thoughts on the Navy Game


  • It was great seeing Robert Hughes get in the end zone and even better seeing all of his teammates mob him on the sideline afterwards.
  • If Clausen is healthy, he should be starting next weekend. Weis wouldn’t throw Sharpley under the bus, but he can’t be happy with what he saw. Saying Sharpley’s accuracy is suspect is an understatement. He just misses too many open receivers, takes too long to make his decisions, and is too careless with the football.
  • Where did Armando Allen go? 91 yards on 16 carries but Aldridge kept getting the ball when he was clearly tiring out. By the end of the game Aldridge’s yards/carry was under 4.0 because he was wearing down. Allen is looking more and more like a potential big time back. Get him the ball.
  • Robby Parris took another step back this week. He had a couple chances to make a play – most notably a dropped touchdown in the 3rd quarter.
  • Duval Kamara meanwhile keeps improving and had his first career two touchdown performance.
  • Why oh why can’t we run a damn screen? I’ve lost count of how many times this year that a screen play has been blown up by 1 single defender knifing through the Irish “blockers.” Turkovich was the lead blocker on two screens in particular where he didn’t touch a single Navy defender.
  • What happened to Golden Tate? Navy did not have a single defender who could have kept up with him but we didn’t see a single deep pass thrown his way.
  • Say what you want about Travis Thomas, but he had 3 runs in regulation that all ended with touchdowns and he got little to no blocking on any of them.
  • Asaph Schwapp also had one of his better games and actually made some blocks. He’s been much maligned across all of the ND blogs, but he did OK out there this weekend.


  • Linebackers really didn’t do a whole heck of a lot out there. Crum had a good first series but after that, the inside backers were eaten up and the outside backers played very undisciplined. John Ryan at one point in the first half went to tackle the Navy QB even though Brockington had him covered. Ryan still went after the QB and left the pitch man wide open. Navy got a 12 yard gain. Overall though, none of the outside backers played the option well.
  • Laws is an animal. I feel bad for him because of all of the losses, but he made himself many more millions by coming back this year.
  • Ian Williams played well filling in for Pat Kuntz. It would be nice if he could see more time at NT with Kuntz seeing some time at DE since that might be where he is at next year.
  • Darrin Walls has improved a lot this year. In the beginning of the year he would shy away from contact in the run game, but he made some nice plays and his forced fumble could have been huge if there was any other Notre Dame defender anywhere near the play.
  • Bruton didn’t play a lot because he was slowed all week in practice, but Weis did say that he was full speed by the end of the week. If he really was full speed I don’t see why he didn’t play more.
  • Overall the defense did not look prepared to defend the option at all. Guys weren’t sticking to their assignments and as soon as Notre Dame stopped something, Navy just moved on to something else and stayed a step ahead of the Irish in terms of adjustments. This was Corwin Brown’s first game as a DC defending the option so let’s hope he improves a lot in the next week.

Special Teams

  • Allen nearly broke a couple nice returns but still keeps getting tripped up right when you think he’s about to take it to the house.
  • The only punt return by Zibby was excellent and should have set us up for the win.
  • There’s really no reason or excuse for not having a kicker who can kick a 41 yard field into some wind to win a game. None. Whatsoever. Really, I’m at a loss for words on this one. Weis didn’t have a FG kicker when he got here and instead of waiting for Kai Forbath during his first class he handed out scholarships like he was hading out skittles and now we have three scholarship kickers – none of whom can kick a 41 yard field goal into some wind apparently. On the season, ND kickers are a combined 1 for 5 on all field goal attempts of 30 yards or more.
  • Sorry, still trying to comprehend how the kicking game could be as bad as it is…. bare with me here.
  • So anyway, here’s hoping Brandon Walker improves a lot this season and spends January-July kicking field goals all day long because I think the kid’s got some talent.
  • Check that, Walker needs to do some lifting too because it would be nice to see a touchback every once in a while.


  • This might have been Weis’s worst coached game since taking over. The fake field goal, the no field goal, play calling, etc all were just bad. No excuse for them.
  • Brown had a baptism by fire with the option this week and will need to make some major adjustments.

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  1. bleednd82,
    Without spending a whole lot of time on it, do a google search on Bob. Use the whole posted name. He is not currently affiliated with ND, which is OK except at one point he made some vague assertions that he was part of something at ND. The list format is a favorite technique to make opinions look like a list of facts — interesting. He’s a lawyer ( possibly retired ) from the LA area. He hits SEVERAL blogs and comments.

  2. I think Bob has some issues. I havent been on here in a few days and that guy seems kinda screwy. Is he trying to say on this website there are “vicious attacks”? I love this site and I wouldnt change a thing. ND has stunk it up this year, BIG TIME and some critism is def warranted. I am a very loyal fan and alum (05) and I respect the team and coaches but common, we have the right to complain as fans. I go to every home game and yell and scream as loud as I can. Even the older people behind me that yell at me to sit down, still doesnt stop me. I am a true fan and I think that BoB is just confused about what possibly a “fan” is. Maybe he should start visiting for all his updates and stats. I hear they love the Irish fans.

  3. The real shock of the game was: ball on 24 yd line; 45 seconds LEFT and NO Field Goal attempt? Doesn’t ND have a Soccor team player who can kick a ball (any size or shape) 40 YARDS?????

  4. Frank,
    I’m with you here. Well put and spot on. I think Bob’s being a little sensitive here. This is a great website and one which it appears has ND loyalists and fans. And I’ve read enough to say you guys are legit. Bob, might not like Blue and Gold Illustrated either then, because if you read any of Tom Pagna’s stuff or even some of the guest commentary from other former players and coaches, there is plenty of respectful criticism. It’s natural since those guys all succeeded and know what it takes. I get the sense they are trying to nicely support the current staff with good advice and mentoring.
    As you say criticism and concern when the results aren’t there is much better than blind praise.
    I can’t quite get why Bob is taking it so personnally. It doesn’t seem like he has any affiliation with the administration or athletic department of Notre Dame.
    The garbage on the outside websites bugs me but I’ve learned as I stated earlier that it’s mostly anonymous punks, who intrude the legitimate discussion group. Almost always not from the home team’s fan base.
    The analysis and discussion on this site is very much like being at each game. I live and hour and a half from ND, but with three kids it’s hard to get down there. This is a great alternative and a lot of fun. Keep up the good work UHND

  5. I’m not sure what “vicious attacks” you speak of, but considering some of the blogs that were posted Saturday and Sunday, I would say that UHND is far more positive than most.

    There’s a difference between being “vicious” and making a critical comment about a team’s performance. As someone who works in a design field, I can easily say my work improves far more from constructive criticism than blind praise. If I was told everything I ever did was wonderful, I would never improve just as a football team will never improve if everyone tells them its ok to lose.

    You can be supportive of a team, which I think UHND certainly is consdierng 3 of us are still making the trip to South Bend this weekend, while also being critical.

  6. frank and chris,

    1. sure, we are certain that charlie, corwin, their staffs,their families, and the current and future notre dame players have had discussions about the material found on these so-called notre dame fan sites.

    2. however, why any of us should have to have had these discussions is beyond us.

    3. my son and i and our family and friends have resolved never to look at any of these so called notre dame fan sites ever again on the grounds that the people who make those vicious and ignorant attacks on notre dame coaches and players on those sites are not real notre dame fans like the fine loyal people we see at notre dame athletic contests and should be given no more credibilty than the espns of this world.

    4. since we can see no legitimate reason for such sites to exist or to receive any of our attention or monetary support, we will rely solely on for reliable information on notre dame sports until an authentic notre dame fan site comes along.

    therefore, goodbye from us and our family and friends and have fun with one another,

    bob gilleran

  7. Bob,
    I’m sure Charlie has steeled his son to ignore all this stuff. Unfortunately, the hate and ghetto mentality drive sports these days. The anonymoty of the internet make it even easier to promote hate and dissention, without fact to back it up. But I am told the more internet saavy of the younger generation understand the bogus nature of many internet discussion groups. I’ll give some examples. There was a fireLou website supposedly authored by a loyal South Carolina student. After his departure, the author disclosed that he was actually a student from arch rival Clemson and stated that he had “punked” the South Carolina “nation”. Now I have a hard time getting over the ghetto/tribal language, but that aside, it proves you don’t know who the authors are out there. I myself last year got caught in a flame war as it is termed with some trailer trash guy claiming to be a marine who was intruding on a pro Notre Dame chat room and who also claimed to be affiliated with the Boston college “nation”. This guy was so vulgar he kept getting kicked off by the moderator only to return with some other handle. Several didn’t want my attempts to keep the thing clean or respectable but said that sports are all about hate, smack talk, and vulgarity towards any other team other than your own, but also your own too. It truly saddened me.

    But I would remind your son to keep the faith, because as a 3rd generation Domer, I’ve seen the good, bad and otherwise, and I wouldn’t have gone anywhere else. It truly is likely that the few who are using ND’s current struggles to act out vicious feelings may be intruders from other fan bases with nothing better to do.

    And I’m sure Charlie knew what he was getting into when he took the job. At least it’s not like an SEC or Texas school where people get constant death threats over this back yard kids game.

  8. frank and chris,

    1. you made a very good point when you suggested that we should not confuse so-called notre dame fan sites with espn and other sites.

    2. charlie has a 13 year old son who, right now, would like to go to college at notre dame. i also have a son of the same age, who is very impressed with what his distant cousin ruth riley did while she was at notre dame and who raves about her experience there.
    3. like my son, charlie’s son has the academic and athletic talent to go to any school in the world that he wants.

    4. in both cases, money is no problem.

    5. however, my son reads the internet and so does charlie’s son. my son understands the vicious attacks on charlie and nd players on the espn and other enemy sites.

    6. however, when he sees even more vicious attacks on charlie and particular notre dame football players on sites that claim to be notre dame fan sites, he asks me”how could any real notre dame fan possibly make such vicious statements on the internet? maybe i should go somewhere else.”

    7. based on some of the vicious diatribes that we have both found on these notre dame fan sites, i really have to agree with him and i am certain that the same thoughts are passing through the minds of charlie and his son, with very good reason.

    8. now. let us suppose that we are in the living room of the family of a notre dame recruit with charlie and corwin. they have told the truth about the value of a notre dame education and of their ability, as coaches with experience at both levels, to give each recruit his best shot at a career in the nfl, such as my cousin ruth has had in the wnba, along with her olympic gold medal.

    they have also bragged about notre dame’s loyal fans all over the world.

    9. either at this point or later, the recruit and his family come across one or more of these vicious diatribes against charlie weis or mo crum, just as one example.

    10. naturally, if a large loyal fan base is really one of notre dame’s greatest assets, who are these people making these ignorant vicious ad hominem attacks?

    11. why would i ever want any of my sons to go to a school when certain fans are going to attack viciously both the coaches and individual players when anything goes wrong, such as this one bad season?

    12. no, we cannot agree that the vicious attacks we have seen on this and other so called notre dame fan sites are simply expressions by notre dame fans of concern about their football team having one bad year.

    13. they are vicious, baseless ad hominem attacks made against charlie and iundividual players by some very mean sprited people who, quite frankly, do not have the foggiest idea what they are writing about.

    14. these are people frustrated with their own lives for reasons which we do not know taking great pleasure in these vicious and baseless attacks.

    15. no, these so called notre dame fan websites are a very serious problem for notre dame and for the very things for which notre dame is supposed to stand.

    16. notre dame will never fire charlie or any of his staff. however, with a 13 year old son going to high school in south bend, charlie just might get disgusted and quit.

    17. i certainly would think about that very seriously.

    18. in the case of konrad reuland, it is exactly these vicious attacks on notre dame fan sites that drove him, with the agreement of his family, away from notre dame.

    19. as in any family, crticisms are made in private. vicious ad hominem attacks on family members in public are simply not permissible.

    20. none of the 30,000 + notre dame fans that we saw at the rose bowl this season were the vicious types that we find venting their anger and frustration about their opwn lives on notre dame coaches and players.

    21. these vicious ignorant jerks who spew their venom on these notre dame fan sites are notre dame’s most serious problem and they will continue to drive fine students and student athletes away from notre dame until they clean up their acts.

    22. there is one solution-delete every vicious negative ad hominem attack since the people who post them are not worthy of being notre dame fans.

    23. matters having to do with the hiring and firing of coaches are already dealt with in house and, after the disastrous manner in which tyrone was treated, in a civilized and polite manner consistent with the values and principles for which notre dame is suppoesed to stand.

    24. such decisions are made by professionals, not by vicious mobs flooding the internet with their personal diatribes under the delusion that they have any say in such matters, something which charlie learned asa student at notre dame when father hesburgh invited charlie over to his office to express charlie’s opinions about how the notre dame football team should be run.

    think about these matters and have a good day,

    bob gilleran

  9. Bob,
    One more thing that seems to come through in your posts. The idea that ND’s recruiting is going to solve all our woes is somewhat overstated. Devine, Parsegian, and Holtz certainly did well enough even in off recruiting years. Other schools have done very well with less talent. Besides, who wants to root only for the best team money can buy. We’d all be Yankees fans, yuck! America roots for the underdog, the team that beats the odds. Notre Dame having a mixture of talent and some less talented but with heart is the romantic ideal of the past recreated by even Holtz in recent history. Reggie Ho, Stan Smegala, Pat Eilers are names that come to mind from the last National Championship team. I knew those guys and they were fairly regular guys save for a burning light within them that drove them beyond their supposed abilities. Ned Bolcar was another from that team. Certainly there was top talent on that team but Holtz knew to go beyond with the right chemistry of overachieving guys to augment the guys with five star talent.
    Another concern that has been raised is a comparison to the worst years with comparitive talent. This team still has enough talent to do better right now than it is doing and that is a concern about the coaching staff. This is not a vicious attack but rather and observation of some blatant mistakes in philosophy going back to Weis’ transition from the NFL game. We all want him to learn, but learn and adapt he must, otherwise that great talent coming in won’t be properly molded and prepared. That great talent won’t stay unless nurtured to it’s potential.
    Charlie and his staff are real good but not perfect, and not beyond crutique. They also have two great weights to carry: 1. 18 years of frustration in wanting that next National Championship. 2. The mis-perception that Ty Willingham was not given a fair chance.
    Hopefully Weis and his coaches have the stuff to satisfy burden 1. and to put burden 2. to rest once and for all.

  10. Bob,
    Don’t confuse the discussion here on this site with those at other sites like ESPN, Fox, or CBS. The comments written here are by concerned fans and/or alums who want the best for our school. It’s only football, but for ND it does provide a window to the rest of our community and in some ways, American Catholics, so it does take on some greater importance.
    There is frustration this year. That’s obvious. Considering the simmering hate that has boiled over into ridicule, that many of us have to endure at work, school, or around our communities, merely for wearing the colors of our alma mater, it’s not always easy to take. Charlie said it himself, that the rest of us have more to deal with on that front than he does. He doesn’t have time. So give the rest of the commenters a break in the spirit of democratic discussion. Again to quote Charlie, that fact that they care and are frustrated is a healthy thing.

  11. frank,

    1. with respect to your questions about the right of any real notre dame fan to criticize notre dame coaches and players, of course anyone has that right.

    2. however, as the author of the immortal story “the good , the bad, and the espn..’, you certainly are aware that the espn, notre dame’s enemies, and other media hacks are constanting monitoring each and every site claiming to be notre dame fans and looking for material to use against notre dame in the recruiting and other wars that are constantly going on out there.

    3. these people are consistently lifting nd coach and player bashing material from sites claiming to be notre dame fan sites and using those vicious attacks against notre dame in the recruiting wars.

    they mail these materials to notre dame players, commits, and recruits. if you think that such materials have not cost notre dame many fine recruits, then you are extremely naieve and we do not think that you are.

    4. we have found a great deal of material lifted from your site on usc sites with the authors congratulating themselves on how the notre dame fan base hates their coaches and players.

    5. on several occasions, when we have attacked a number of these vicious attackers on your site, we have found our material deleted by you or someone on your staff because some of these people came crying to you or someone on your staff. freedom of speech should be a two way street.

    6. these people who engage in these nd bashing diatribes should realize that everything they post on your site and other sites that claim to be notre dame fan sites are copied and then used against notre dame in the recruiting wars.

    7. now, we are certain that, when you justifiably wanted to throw your tv set against your wall because of the nd bashing comments made by certain idiots at the espn, you did not want to become a source of such material, as your site has.

    8. these vicious nd bashing diatribes get copied and mailed to notre dame players, verbal commits and their families and student athletes charlie, corwin, and their staffs are trying to recruit for 2008 and future years.

    9. so, sure, any real notre dame fan has a right to criticize anything that they want. however, they also have an obligation not to give aid and comfort to the enemy.

    10. the records of charlie, corwin, and their staffs speak for themselves. having accomplished the miracles that they did on the field in 2005 and 2006 and, on the recruiting trail in 2006, 2007, and 2008, they simply should have earned the faith and trust of every real notre dame fan by now.
    11. none of us are qualified to second guess any coaching decisions made by professionals with excellent track records and none of these vicious attacks are going to change the fact that charlie and corwin and their staffs willbe at notre dame for many years to come, no matter what any of us thinks.

    12. we certainly have the right to attack anyone making such vicious attacks against the nd coaches and players by anyone trying to give aid and comfort to the espns of this world, of which there are many, without having our attacks deleted by you or anyone on your staff, as has happened before on several occasions.

    thank you for your inspirations and eloquence,

    bob gilleran

  12. frank,

    1. we never thought that the author of those immortal words “the good, the bad, and the espn..” would be in the tank for very long.

    2. welcome back, perhaps we will see you at the air force game, at the duke game, and at the stanford game.

    3. we will be at every game, especially this 2007 season.

    have a great day,

    bob gilleran

  13. 1. with respect to the manner in which charlie, corwin, and their staffs pick recruits for notre dame, they get game film from the high schools well before any rankings are given out by those recruiting services.

    2. after they have chosen their targets, they visit each high school in person and watch the recruits in person.

    3. they check the grades and disciplinary records of every student athlete whom they have targeted.

    4. then, they spend quality time with each recruit and with their families.

    5. they could not care less how many stars a student athlete is given by rivals or scout.

    6. it is coaches like pete carroll who wait for the star ranking to come out and go after the recruits with the highest rankings, without any concern for grades, character, or their families.

    7. the fact that the verbal commits secured by charlie, corwin and their staffs have ended up coinciding with the no 1 recruiting class in the us in 2008 is simply a coincidence or perhaps the people who run those outfits are starting to understand that charlie, corwin, and their staffs really understand how to identify excellent football players.

    8. the recruiting services do not take into account at all grades or character at all when they award their stars.

    9. these are among the factors that make the jobs done by charlie, corwin, and their staffs even more amazing.

    10. when they make offers and receive verbal commitments, the commitment that notre dame gives is not like that given by any other school in the nation.

    11. every student athlete who makes a verbal commit to notre dame has a full scholarship to notre dame even if they have a career ending injury in high school after they make their verbal commitments to notre dame or if they suffer a football career ending injury playing for notre dame after they get to notre dame.

    12. after the problems with verbal commits backing out at the last minute before signing day last year, charlie and corwin and their staffs sat down to solve that problem and the solution that they came up with certainly has worked for both sides.

    13. could any other group of coaches in the nation have come up with such an elegant and fair and honest solution.

    14. we have not seen any.

    have a nice day,

    bob gilleran

  14. bob,

    I would like to think I don’t have to rejoin the millions of Notre Dame fans because I don’t believe I have ever left them. Sorry you disagree with my analysis, but I think you can be critical of a team while still being a true fan.

    In fact, I would argue that only a true fan can critically look at their team and make honest comments about them. Considering I am still flying out to South Bend and attending the Air Force game despite the state of the team, I also tend to think I’m clearly out of the tank.

  15. 1. charlie, corwin, and their staffs will be at notre dame for many years winning national championships.

    2. yes, there was no depth of talent on the 2006 and 2006 notre dame teams at any position, although there were certainly some very fine players. just look at the tape of the lsu sugar bowl game after one player, derek landri, went down with an injury around halftime. since there was no depth of talent to replace him, the whole complexion of the game changed while lsu platooned very talented players in and out at every position.

    3. when the 2008 notre dame recruiting class arrives at notre dame next summer, notre dame will have talent at every position and depth of talent at every position, something that notre dame has not had for decades.

    4. it is that depth of talent that creates the option of holding those joe moore type of hard hitting practices that turn talented high school players into talented college players playing together like synchonized swimmers well before the 1st game of the 2008 season begins since the depth of talent permits the notre dame team to absorb the number of injuries that go along with those hard hitting practices.

    5. notre dame football finally has the perfect group of coaches for the future and some people who claim to be real notre dame fans are taking vicious pot shots at them.

    6. those of you who are doom and gloomers remind me of the union troops that went out to engage the south in the 1st battle of the civil war( aptly named the 1st battle of bull run), along with a lot of people from washington,dc, who took picnic baskets with them to watch.

    7. as soon as the 1st shots were fired and some people were actually killed and injured, both the union troops and the picknickers turned tail and rode or ran back to washington dc as quickly as they could.

    8. we have no doubt at all that notre dame can defeat her enemies on the outside.

    9. as for the spoiled ignorant people who really have some notre dame connections, we suppose that we will simply not allow any of them in the foxholes on any front line.

    10. because decisions about notre dame football are now made by people who are professionals in that field and understand what we do, instead of the amateurs that used to make such decisions, we know that there is absolutely nothing that the doom and gloomers and the nd coach and player bashers can to to change to current situation.

    11. the fact is that charlie and corwin and their staffs will be at notre dame for many years winning many national championships and there is simply nothing that any of notre dame’s enemies or the traitors within can do about that.

    12. your options are to show charlie, corwin, their staffs, and the notre dame players your support and give them your thanks or you can become fans of a crooked college football program, like usc, the university for spoiled children.

    have a nice day,

    bob gilleran

  16. I just hope Charlie get’s this team looking solid, both in terms of play, and phsychologically believing that they are ND and can beat anyone. Bleend82, you are right to point out that Corwin is a black coach and has the makings of a fine one. This defense needs one year to get solid and another to look like the Barry Alvarez D’s. If Weis can block out the pressure, but realize it’s goto to get real good real soon, he may draw upon some old ND coaches and try to learn what he needs to make his system a success. I hope there’s some old ND magic s soon as next year.

  17. I will agree also that pushing Holts was just insane also with the hiring of Davie? That man is a horrible announcer to go along with coach, recruiter. ND has had poor recruiting in key areas on the D. Darrin Walls will be one of the best corners next yr. Mcneil should be more polished as well. ND’s D is going to have quite a few Fr out there next yr. I know clausen is/was hurt but he has not impressed me at all. Now, with saying that there is a lot of upside the possibility of improvement. A. Better Line. B. Better more experienced receivers Kumara, Tate, and incoming Floyd. C.Dayne Christ looks friggin amazing and I think he is going to give Jimbo a run for his money. D. We are stacked at running back. Two Years I predict we are top 5 team. I hope the recruits keep coming in cause it seems that is one of charlies strengths.

  18. Chris:

    I see where your coming from with every loss this season needs to be a W next. I know ND has received a lot of bad press for firing a “black coach” but didnt we just hire a very “black” coach in Corwin Brown? I dont look at it all as black and white but everyone else seems to be. I think people need to just set back and get off ND’s supposed racist firing of Ty. I mean didnt ND hire the guy in the first place? Did they hire him because they are racist or biased? I dont get it.

  19. Charlie’s problem has been defensive recruiting taking only 8 players in 05, 9 in 06, and 7 in 07. You factor in player busts and injuries and this D could suck for the next two years.

  20. Bleednd82,
    I hope you are right about ND only needing 7 wins to feel good, and you are probably right about the team not having any hope to win 10 games. But given the reasons for firing Willingham, and all the bad press about ND not treating a black head coach properly, I think every loss this season inversely sets the expectations for next year. That sounds strange, but since it’s ND, and Weis looked like the answer early on, there’s already a high bar that’s been set. Patience may be running out.

    I’d like to see Weis succeed. And obviously we’d all like to see ND do well. So I don’t want anyone to think I’m anti-Weis. I put that 10 game winmark out there because under Davie and Willingham, Notre Dame had some good seasons. Under Weis, Notre Dame had two good seasons and is having possibly the worst season in it’s history. Weis is now being compared to Willingham and really the expectation was that by now, he would have distanced himself from that level of play by creating consistency, season to season. A 7 win season was expected to be his low point. I simply think that pressure from alumni, the public, and many in the African American community that care about the ND/Willingham affair will be calling for Weis’s head in year 4 if year 3 doesn’t look like a pure fluke. ND needs something definitive to quiet those who cried racism over Willingham’s early termination. I don’t necessarily agree since insiders tell me Willingham interviewed with Washington, the very morning of his last USC game as ND coach, but ND fired him first, so we look bad, not him. Unless Weis wins multiple National Championships, and puts a perennial power out there, the critics will have a strong voice.

  21. This season is the culmination of mistakes made over the past 10 years. This team needs to go 2-10 so that all involved, coaches, players and administration all know what the “bottom” looks like. This way they will know that they never want to go back their again.
    I’m as loyal a fan as anybody but the comedy of errors that have taken place over the past 10 years is mind-numbing. Pushing Holtz out, hiring Davie, hiring O’Leary (oops), hiring Willingham, dancing with Meyer, hiring Weis and then giving him a 10 extension!!!!! Just absolutely crazy. They have made there bed and we must all sleep in it.

  22. Chris:

    I dont believe charlie has to win atleast 10 games to save his job. I do think they need to get 7 w’s. Anything less would like you said “look bad” on ND’s part with the Ty’s firing. Looking at the schedule next year there is no reason we cant win 7 games. 7-5 with going to a bowl and hopefully winning should be just fine. I am speaking from my own pt of view of course but there is no way they are going to win 10 games next year.

    A loss is a loss no matter who it’s to. Yes, I have respect for Navy but we should pound them into the ground like we have for 40+ years. I cannot believe we have no kicker that can kick past 30 yds. That is just sad. ND is really bad and I think for the first time Im going to put a lot of blame on Charlies play calling.

    Heres to a better day that we get a W.

  23. ND has a real problem here.

    It’s good to keep rooting the team on and as an alum I always will. I have never booed even when completely frustrated.

    But here’s the problem. This Willingham business will keep haunting the University until the program is solidly on a 8 plus win per season streak with National Championships. ND also needs to get rid of the NBC contract as the backlash has haunted the school all the way back to 1993. Holtz attributed it to FSU getting the N.C. over ND even though we beat them. Weis will have to win AT LEAST 10 games AND a bowl game next year or the University will be obliged to “retire” him or see him leave for health reasons or something. Anything less will vindicate Willingham supporters. It doesn’t matter that Willingham was about to quit anyway. It looks so bad publicly that something special will need to happen to overcome it. Weis unfortunately may be the next victim.
    We can talk about all the recruiting we want, but lack of fundamental preparation calls everything else into question. If ND looks this bad through what’s left of the season, or in any game in September next year, there will be mass defections and a change will occur before the season’s over. It’s just that bad right now.

    Weis only has next year. 10 wins or more plus a bowl win or it’s over. Can this team and this coaching staff do that?

  24. charlie took those undermanned 2005 and 2006 notre dame teams to 2 bcs bowls in a row

    Undermanned???? Quinn, Jeff S., Mcnight, Darius Walker, Ndukwe???? Not exactly undermanned by any standards. By the way, those were Ty’s recruits.

    12. the results are clear enough-2 top 10 recruiting classes in 2006 and 2007 and the no 1 recruiting class for 2008 in the face of a terrible win loss record on paper.

    That sounds great, but at some point that talent has to be developed. Other big name schools have no problems playing freshmen, and seeing immediate results(see Illinois and Florida).

    3. did charlie have a plan for winning a lot more games this season? he certainly did.jimmy clausen was and is the best prepared qb ever to come out of any high school and more ready to step right in to a starting role in college than any other qb in history.

    Does the name Ron Pawlus ring a bell? SI cover boy who never quite lived up to the hype.

    I am a huge Weiss supporter and don’t want to see him go anywhere, but let’s face it, the program is in bad, bad shape right now. Here’s to hoping he can turn it around quickly!!!!!!!!

  25. Mr. Gilleran, I have to admire your emphasis on integrity on a lot of your posts (I am 100% with you by the way, this is college athletics not the NFL minor leagues like so many college programs treat it). But at what point do we hold Charlie accountable for this season? I feel that he has done a great job recruiting, but they have to play better than this. There schedule looked tough in the preseason but it turns out not to be. G Tech is not the good, Michigan State has fallen apart as usual (But the do always get up to play Notre Dame), and Purdue turned out to be a pretender. To the point, how much do you think this season’s turnout is because of lack of talent and how much is to be blamed on the coaching job Weis has done?

  26. After each and every game, the similarities between Charlie Weis and Tyrone Willingham are more and more apparent. The only difference is that Charlie is better at recruiting (although recruiting rankings are often overrated – look at USC’s receivers and running backs). But recruiting isn’t enough to win football games if the players are not developed, the players are not put in the right situation to utilize their skill sets, and the coaching is horrendous (i.e., bad play calling and bad decision making). Granted, the players made some huge mistakes that prevented us from winning (e.g., Joe Brockington’s face mask on 3rd and long, Eric Olsen’s missed blocks on the fake punt, fumble return for a touchdown, and the nearly fatal holding on 3rd and long in the 4th quarter). But Charlie’s play calling, decision making, and lack of understanding of personnel is mind-boggling. The final minutes of the game are a microcosm of Charlie’s flaws. First, on ND’s second to last possession (following Zibby’s good punt return), on 2nd and 8, Charlie calls a pass play. We’ve been running on Navy all day long and this is the time of the game where the bigger, stronger offensive line that has been wearing down the undersized defense of Navy should have dominated. Instead, we try to pass and Evan goes for the out pass to David Grimes. Mind you, Evan attempted this same pass three times to Grimes, with two incompletions and the one completion bobbled. So, it’s now 3rd and 8 and we apparently don’t have a kicker that can make a field goal over 40 yards. So, now we decide to run the ball? We get stuffed for one yard. It’s 4th down, do we try the field goal? No! Charlie decides to go for it. Evan drops back and gets sacked. This series shows the problems with Charlies Weis. Why are we passing on 2nd and 8 with the running success we’ve had. Why are we not attempting a game winning field goal. Bad play calling. Bad coaching decision. Also, lack of understanding of personnel. Why, in a key series, is David Grimes in there? He’s coming off an injury and when he was healthy, we wasn’t doing much. Surely Golden Tate offers the same, if not better speed, and definitely better hands. Same for why Armando Allen is in there on the 4th down play. Armando is a good running back, but he is a freshman (who doesn’t fully understand pass blocking) and the smallest running back on the roster. Why are we having Armando pass blocking on this most critical play? We should have had a bigger, more experienced running back in there to pick up that block. Charlie made the Navy defender look like Roy Williams from Oklahoma in that game against Texas! Hopefully Charlie gets this ship righted soon and that he swallows his pride and learns from the mistakes he made in this game. His decision making, his play calling, and his understanding of the personnel on the field all must improve.

  27. frank.

    1.while no one ever likes to lose at anything, we must respectfully disagree with your analysis of the notre dame navy game.

    2. 1st, we congratulate a fine navy team on their fine hard fought win. unlike many of notre dame’s opponents, the naval academy always plays the game with honesty and integrity.

    we have always understood why other schools refuse to schedule the naval academy. they are afraid of playing against the future members of the united states marine corps.

    physical size simply does not matter when a team like navy operates like a sychronized swimming team.

    3. did charlie have a plan for winning a lot more games this season? he certainly did.jimmy clausen was and is the best prepared qb ever to come out of any high school and more ready to step right in to a starting role in college than any other qb in history.

    however, when jimmy’s bone spur showed up( jimmy had played through the pain his entire senior season at high school), charlie made the right decision for notre dame and for jimmy by going ahead with the surgical procedure.

    4. the projections for jimmy’s return to health were correct.however,the physicians did not take into account the toll that the procedure would have on jimmy ability to throw during rehab or to work out his upper body, as brady quinn did before the 2005 season and the lack of quality time that jimmy would have to develop that essential chemistry with his receivers and with the offense.

    5. because of the lack of depth of talent at so many position, the type of hard hitting joe moore type of practices, which turn talented high school players into talented college players with real game experience before the season starts were also not an option because of the injury factor.

    6. when charlie came to notre dame, he found great talent at many positions, little or no talent at other positions, and zero depth so that one key injury could easily have resulted in a season with a paper record like 2007 so far.

    7. charlie took those undermanned 2005 and 2006 notre dame teams to 2 bcs bowls in a row.

    8. in 2006,2007, and 2008, charlie and corwin and their staffs went to work on the fundamental problem with notre dame’s football program-recruiting. that had been the case ever since lazy bob davie took over recruiting during the last years of the holtz era when lou was caring for his very ill wife.

    9. davie’s idea of recruiting was to sit in his office in south bend admiring himself in the mirror while the notre dame recruiting network died on the vine.

    10. tyrone was just another victim of the damage that lazy bob davie had done at notre dame.

    11. in the past 3 years, charlie and his staff have visited high schools all over the us, where the coaching staffs had not seen anyone from notre dame in decades and they brought the notre dame recruiting network back from the dead with honesty and integrity, instead of getting in the sewers and cheating, as many of notre dame’s opponents do on a regular basis.

    12. the results are clear enough-2 top 10 recruiting classes in 2006 and 2007 and the no 1 recruiting class for 2008 in the face of a terrible win loss record on paper.

    13. there is not another group of coahes in the us who would have dedicated the time and effort to recruiting that charlie, corwin, and their staffs have done in the face of withering fire from the enemy camps and from a few spoiled misguided members of the notre dame community who should be ashamed of themselves.

    14.we are especially proud of every single member of this fine courageous 2007 notre dame team who fought through the many adversities of this season and who will win the remaining 3 games this season. is their courage and loyalty which is the cornerstone of the national championships which charlie, corwin, and their staffs will bring to notre dame much more quickly than any of you can imagine.

    16. when the members of that 2008 recruiting class arrive in south bend next summer, notre dame will have something which notre dame has not had in decades, talent at every position and depth of talent at every position.

    17. with that depth of talent comes the ability to hold those joe moore type of hard hitting practices and to absorb whatever injuries do occur well before the 2008 season begins so that when theb 2008 notre dame team hits the field in the fallof 2008, they will be operating like a synchronized swimming team and be playing like seasoned college players from the 1st game of the 2008 season.

    18. and where has lazy bob davie been since he was fired by notre dame? he has been over at the espn directing savage fraudulent attacks at notre dame, both directly and through fronts at the espn and at other media outlets.

    19. as the author of those immortal words-the good, the bad, and the espn, you should know the real source of all that media garbage better than any of us-bob davie.

    20. why? because bob davie is still very bitter about being fired by notre dame. it was davie who told the administration at notre dame that notre dame could never again succeed at football without compromising her academic standards and he continues to live in terror that charlie, corwin, and their staffs will expose davie for the incredible jerk and idiot that he is.

    21. charlie and corwin and their staffs are not going anywhere. they will be at notre dame winning national championships with integrity.

    22. decisions about the notre dame football program are now made by professionals, not by amateurs, and certainly not by the doom and gloomers who flood the internet with negativity about charlie and the notre dame football program.

    most of those people are ethnic and religious bigots hiding behind phony internet identities because they do not have the guts to use their real names.

    yes. there are a very few spoiled ignorant members of the notre dame community who should be ashamed of themselves.

    23.when we look back at this 2007 season, we will say that this season was the finest of charlie’s, corwin’s and their staffs many fine seasons as coaches and we will hold evey member of this 2007 team in the same high esteem in which we hold notre dame’s past and future national championship teams.

    come on frank, get out of the tank, see the light, and rejoin millions of real notre dame fans all over the world in the good fight,

    bob gilleran

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